FRONTLINE

American Insurrection
Over the last three years, FRONTLINE has collaborated with ProPublica to investigate the rise of extremism in America. In the aftermath of the assault on the U.S. Capitol, FRONTLINE and ProPublica team up again to examine how far-right groups were emboldened and encouraged by former President Trump and how individuals were radicalized and brought into the political landscape.
TRANSCRIPT
>> Who'’s our president?!
Trump'’s our president!
Fight for Trump!
>> NARRATOR: They stormed the
capitol.
>> They were hostile, they were
venomous, that their country
somehow was being taken away
from them.
>> NARRATOR: And plotted to
kidnap a governor.
>> A terror plot to kidnap
Governor Gretchen Whitmer.
>> And so, you think the guys
were planning to arrest her?
>> It was going to be a
citizen'’s arrest.
>> NARRATOR: Correspondent A.C.
Thompson investigates the long
road to where we are today.
>> It was a point in my life
where like if I met you,
I would need to know
what race you were.
You're dark enough,
I would need to know.
>> NARRATOR: How these violent
groups have become part of the
political landscape.
>> You'’ve had a pandemic, people
who have lost jobs, people who
questioned the legitimacy of
elections...
This was blood in the water, and
became a feeding frenzy.
We definitely are the modern
militia.
We're the ones crazy enough to
actually do something.
>> The Pentagon has ordered a
military wide stand down to root
out extremism within its
ranks...
>> President Biden directs
law enforcement to study the
urging threat.
>> Domestic Violent Extremism is
one of the number one
threats to this country.
>> NARRATOR: With the Biden
administration promising to
crack down on domestic
extremism.
>> I can just tell you that this
administration sees this
as a top priority.
We're going to do everything
we can to address it.
>> NARRATOR: Now on FRONTLINE,
in collaboration with ProPublica
and US Berkeley Investigative
Reporting Program -
American Insurrection.
>> You really do need that
presidential level leadership
saying, "“This is a threat.
We are gonna use all of our
tools to go after this threat."”
>> A.C. THOMPSON: January 7,
2021.
Washington's streets are quiet,
tense.
Soldiers stand watch around the
perimeter of the U.S. Capitol.
Inside, the halls are deserted.
New members of Congress should
be settling into their offices.
But instead, furniture is
stacked in doorways.
It's hard to believe that just
yesterday, these halls were
flooded with pro-Trump rioters
and that today, four people are
dead.
This is how the Trump presidency
ends.
It's shocking.
Yet there had also been warning
signs.
I wonder, what form will these
violent energies take now?
To find an answer, I feel like I
have to go back to the
beginning.
♪
If the Trump presidency ended
with an insurrection at the
Capitol, for me, it began here,
in Charlottesville, Virginia,
waiting on a darkened campus
for the torches to arrive.
>> (chanting): You will not
replace us!
You will not replace us!
>> THOMPSON: I'd been reporting
on the rise in hate crimes and
America's resurgent white
supremacist movement.
And that led me here.
>> You will not replace us!
You will not replace us!
>> THOMPSON: The rally was
called "Unite the Right."”
White supremacists out in the
open, unafraid, and soon
violent.
(indistinct chatter)
The next morning, I followed a
group of clergy to the rally.
The white supremacists were
returning.
And counter-protesters were
arriving to challenge them.
>> No hate, no fear!
White supremacists not
welcome here!
>> THOMPSON: The white
supremacists came prepared to
fight, bringing guns and knives
and bats and shields.
They attacked people who tried
to block their path, leaving
them bloodied on the pavement
The violence kept escalating
while the police looked on.
Just want to let you know
there's been all kinds of crazy
violence over here.
Pepper spray, people beating
each other with sticks.
We're trying to figure out if
the police are going to
intervene to stop that or if
it's just going to keep going
on.
>> Well, we've all got different
assignments to try to maintain
some sort of order here.
So that's what we're focusing on
right now.
>> THOMPSON: Alongside the
neo-Nazis and white nationalists
were militias and members of a
group we would all come to know,
the Proud Boys.
Its current leader was there
that day.
(shouting)
I had never seen white
supremacists gather in such
large numbers.
(shouting)
But looking back now,
Charlottesville feels like a
prelude of what was to come.
Anger.
Hatred.
Bloodshed.
(screaming)
A neo-Nazi, James Alex Fields,
slammed his car into the crowd,
injuring dozens and killing
32-year-old Heather Heyer.
>> I always wondered, "Was she
afraid?
(sighs) Did she see him coming?"
Dear God, I would love to have
my daughter back.
>> THOMPSON: For you, what does
justice for Heather look like?
>> I don't know.
Nothing's gonna bring Heather
back.
Those of us who miss her, miss
her...
forever.
>> THOMPSON: James Alex Fields
is the person who's been
prosecuted for Heather's murder.
In your mind, is he the only
person who should be held
accountable?
>> No, for people from 35
states to come in to fight,
that's absolutely absurd.
>> You had some very bad people
in that group, but you also had
people that were... very fine
people, on both sides.
>> THOMPSON: At the time, Trump
had only been president for
seven months but his response
set the tone for the next three
years.
And many on the far right took
his words as a sign of support.
>> Wait a minute, I'm not
finished.
I'm not finished, fake news.
That was a horrible day.
I watched those very closely--
much more closely than you
people watched it.
And you have-- you had a group
on one side that was bad.
And you had a group on the other
side that was also very violent.
And nobody wants to say that,
but I'll say it right now.
(rain pattering)
>> THOMPSON: James Fields was
eventually sentenced to life in
prison.
But in the immediate aftermath
of Charlottesville, only a
handful of others were arrested.
I kept asking law enforcement
what was going on.
I got your message saying that
basically we should look at
the Facebook and Twitter posts
you put out, but we have
questions that go beyond that.
Had everyone else just blended
back into society?
Like I said, I'm just trying to
figure out how many, how many
folks have been prosecuted,
and how many cases might still
be in the pipeline.
So, we began trying to locate
the people ourselves.
♪
>> There were a couple of guys
in these few shots that we
weren't able to identify.
I wonder who he is.
'Cause he looks like he's part
of RAM.
>> THOMPSON: Oh yeah, he's
definitely a RAM person.
Over the next year, we tracked
down some of the most violent
individuals in Charlottesville.
Look, he's got his right hand
taped up.
>> Yeah
>> THOMPSON: And then the,
definitely the guy in
Charlottesville has at least
one hand taped up.
>> Right hand.
>> THOMPSON: I wonder if his
left hand is as well.
My colleagues and I matched our
footage with images from
far-right rallies across the
country, we gained access to
encrypted chat logs, and
developed sources inside
extremist networks.
Our reporting led us to groups
that had been in
Charlottesville, including
the Rise Above Movement, or
RAM-- a white power fight club.
Hey, Mike how you doing?
They had also been linked to
multiple attacks in California.
I wanted to talk to you about
what you were doing in
Charlottesville last year.
>> Uh, sorry I don't know
anything about that, man.
>> THOMPSON: But you were there,
you're on camera, you're on
photos.
>> No, I, I think you got the
wrong guy.
>> THOMPSON: Hey, do Northrup
and UCLA know you're involved
with the Rise Above Movement?
>> Gotta go, man.
>> THOMPSON: Michael Miselis was
a RAM member we'd seen punching
a protestor in the face in
Charlottesville.
But Miselis was more than just a
street fighter-- he had a
government security clearance,
and worked for the defense
contractor Northrup Grumman.
As we looked further, we found
other white supremacists and
neo-Nazis with ties to the
military, some of them on
active duty.
It was a problem that would
continue to grow in the coming
years, despite calls to root it
out.
>> The president has to be very
clear about the unacceptability
of these-- any extremists,
including these white
supremacist extremists
acquiring the best military
training in the world.
>> THOMPSON: Keith Ellison, then
a congressman from Minnesota,
had seen our reporting and wrote
to the Pentagon demanding it
take action.
>> Since we wrote that letter,
we have been in verbal contact
with the military that they're
responding to our letter, we
expect to have it soon, but we
have not yet seen it.
>> THOMPSON: We've identified
seven members of one neo-Nazi
group who are current or former
military.
What do you make of that?
>> Well, I think that they have
decided this is a strategic
initiative for them.
They, they want their people to
go into the military.
There's a real legitimate fear
here, and I think that we've got
to be vigilant about it.
>> THOMPSON: The D.O.D.
eventually told Ellison it had
investigated the people we'd
IDed, and had fired or
disciplined 18 service members.
>> I think one thing we can do
is to shine a light on this,
because when we get some light
on it, then somebody somewhere
is going to say, okay, this
needs to become a priority.
And so that's what we're going
to do.
♪
>> THOMPSON: A year after
Charlottesville, the spotlight
was on.
>> We are here today to announce
the arrest of four members of
the militant white supremacist
group known as the Rise Above
Movement.
>> THOMPSON: The FBI arrested
more people who'd been at Unite
the Right, including Michael
Miselis, who lost his job at
Northrop Grumman and spent
about a year in prison.
It felt like our reporting had
helped to expose some of the
most dangerous figures in the
white supremacist scene.
I began receiving death threats
even as the groups splintered,
changed their names, and were
hit with lawsuits.
But one group did continue to
take to the streets--
participating in rallies in
Portland, Oregon-- the Proud
Boys.
>> (chanting): USA! USA! USA!
>> THOMPSON: They had Black
and Latino members, and wanted
to distance themselves from the
white supremacist movement.
They seemed mostly interested in
drinking, fighting, and
supporting Trump.
>> (chanting): USA! USA!
>> THOMPSON: So what's your
deal, man, why-- why are you
here?
>> I'm here to stand up for
freedom.
>> THOMPSON: They faced off
against members of Antifa.
>> They've got one ideology over
there, and these guys have a
freedom-loving ideology.
>> THOMPSON: What do you think
the ideology is over there?
>> It's communism.
>> THOMPSON: They claimed they
were defending the U.S. from
some sort of communist
takeover and they wore shirts
celebrating Pinochet, the
Chilean fascist dictator.
Tell me about your T-shirt.
What's with-- what are you
saying here?
>> It says what it says.
>> THOMPSON: What do you mean by
that?
You're down for fascism is that,
is that what you're saying?
Some wore patches that said
RWDS-- right wing death squad.
Fights broke out sporadically.
But that march in Portland would
be the last I'd see of the Proud
Boys for a while.
I was drawn away to other
stories.
>> (over radio): We're under
fire, we're under fire, he's got
an automatic weapon, he's firing
out of the front of...
>> THOMPSON: There was the
attack on the Tree of Life
synagogue in October 2018 that
left 11 Jewish worshippers dead.
>> 7-1, suspect's talking
about...
>> THOMPSON: And in August 2019
a gunman who'd ranted about a
Hispanic invasion opened fire
in an El Paso Walmart, killing
23 people.
Horrific hate crimes, carried
out not by extremist groups, but
by individuals.
But then, in January 2020,
something different caught my
eye.
(distant cheers)
A rally in Richmond, Virginia.
22,000 people turned out to
protest the state's new gun
laws.
Many of them were mainstream
conservatives, but among the
crowd were also militia members,
white supremacists, and Proud
Boys.
I wondered if the energies from
Charlottesville were gathering
again.
>> (chanting): Drain the swamp!
♪
>> THOMPSON: The rally had been
organized on Facebook and I
found someone who monitors right
wing groups on social media.
>> I'm a computer scientist, my
background's in data mining and
data science, so that means
using, you know, facts and
figures, names, dates, photos,
dollar amounts, just all that
good stuff, and then we look
for patterns in that data.
>> THOMPSON: Megan Squire
tracked the decline of far-right
groups after Charlottesville.
>> Charlottesville was
incredibly disruptive to these
groups.
It started everything from
infighting amongst themselves,
all the arrests that happened
afterwards, and then the
lawsuits were just absolutely
devastating for these groups.
>> THOMPSON: But not every group
suffered from the backlash.
Some, like the Proud Boys,
survived and grew.
>> There were some that, that
escaped unscathed.
They evaded, um, really
responsibility and scrutiny
after Unite the Right and then
you know came up to rear their
ugly heads much later.
>> THOMPSON: Examining 8,000
Facebook accounts affiliated
with the Proud Boys, Squire
found that many Proud Boys also
belonged to white supremacist or
fascist groups.
In Squire's research, one
individual stands out-- Brien
James, the leader of the Indiana
chapter of the Proud Boys.
Brien's in this group and this
is, like, the most hardcore
white supremacist that you're
gonna find out there.
>> Yeah.
>> THOMPSON: We've got the
National Socialist movement
represented here.
We've got, um...
pro-Hitler groups.
We've got all kinds of real
crazy stuff.
>> This is a anti-Muslim group.
Here's an anti-immigrant group.
>> THOMPSON: Brien James was a
key node in Squire's map of the
Proud Boys.
He's been involved with some
of the most extreme movements
of the last three decades--
the Klan, an anti-government
militia, and a neo-Nazi gang
called the Outlaw Hammerskins.
In 2003 he became the leader of
his own gang called the
Vinlanders Social Club.
I pull court records in Indiana.
I don't find any cases for
James, but members of his gang
have been convicted in a string
of beatings and homicides.
I'm surprised and a little
nervous when he agrees to meet
me, and talk openly about his
past as a skinhead leader.
>> I was kind of a dictator
there and I had a much smaller
network of people, but there was
no state in the United States I
could travel to where I didn't
have a place to stay, there was
no shortage of... you know,
women involved in it, you know,
we had... it was guys who would
kill for you in a second.
So there-- you know, I never got
caught or... I was arrested and
charged with some pretty bad
things in my life, but I got a
lawyer and beat all the cases.
>> THOMPSON: James claims he
left the white power movement
behind years ago.
>> There was a point in my life
where like, if I met you, I
would need to know what race you
are, you're dark enough, I
would need to know.
You know, I would obviously--
he's not white, and that would
have an impact on how I viewed
him.
>> THOMPSON: I've met people
who've left the white
supremacist movement before.
Most of them go out of their way
to express remorse for the
people they've harmed, the
things that they've done.
I don't hear a lot of that from
James.
>> I haven't flipped over to the
left, I haven't gotten-- it's
not like I've changed, it's just
that doesn't matter.
It certainly doesn't matter as
much as other things.
Ideology is the primary
motivating factor to me and
whether or not the country is
going to turn out okay or not.
>> THOMPSON: But James was there
in Charlottesville at Unite the
Right, marching alongside Nazis
and white nationalists.
I ask him why, as a man who had
supposedly abandoned the white
power movement, he was so
willing to work with avowed
racists.
>> I think most people look back
on Charlottesville as a mistake,
and I do, I mean, we certainly
didn't need those guys, we
certainly didn't gain anything
from working with those guys,
especially after I had left.
I thought we were doing
something positive, and
obviously that day turned out to
be a horrible disaster and the
impact of people who was there,
was pretty severe after it was
over, so I thought all right.
>> THOMPSON: People went to
prison, people left the
movement.
>> People lost their jobs,
people were de-platformed off
of the public forum, people
were financially de-platformed.
>> THOMPSON: James doesn't
mention the killing of Heather
Heyer or the people murdered by
his former gang.
But he does spend a lot of time
talking about his new ideology,
which he calls civic
nationalism, a label adopted by
many Proud Boys.
>> THOMPSON: And as a civic
nationalist, what are your
issues?
What are your bedrock beliefs?
>> Individual liberty and
adhering to the Constitution as
much as possible, um...
I don't like this climate where
we take away accountability,
where we try to force equality
of outcomes, instead of equal
opportunity.
I don't like cancel culture and
political correctness to a large
extent.
People see the left is taking
over and moving society in a
certain direction.
So, we're just the ones that are
the tip of the spear out
standing up for that physically.
>> THOMPSON: James tells me that
by focusing on political enemies
instead of racial ones, he'd
gained more support.
>> I mean, I've been doing what
I'm doing here for 30 years, and
there's normally five, ten guys
in the city, maybe 20 in the
state.
I have 200 right now.
>> THOMPSON: Wow.
>> Yeah.
>> THOMPSON: He'd also found a
powerful new ally in Trump.
>> Well, you've got a guy who's
a nationalist in the most
powerful seat in the world.
I mean, we've got a guy who's,
you know, at least 75, 80, 90%
on our side, and he's the
president, there's no reason
at that point to be... an
extremist.
>> THOMPSON: You've been
involved in right-wing movements
for decades now, what was the
time period that you found
yourself having the most hope
for real change?
>> Now.
>> THOMPSON: Now?
>> Yeah.
♪
>> THOMPSON: After my
conversation with Brien James, I
check in with a longtime source
of mine, Pete Simi.
Simi helped me understand RAM
and the other groups in
Charlottesville, and he's
continued to track the white
supremacist movement.
I just interviewed a guy named
Brien James.
Have you ever come across this
guy?
>> Oh sure, yeah, he was,
especially during his time as
the Vinlander, he was a big
name on the radar and, you
know, really associated with a
lot of violence.
The Vinlander, the Vinlanders in
general were known to be a very
volatile, violent group that,
you know, they had a guy whose
nickname was "The Butcher," and
so, I mean this is...
>> THOMPSON: This is the guy
with "murder" tattooed on his
throat?
>> Yeah, right, right.
So, I mean, there was a number
of very violent incidents they
were involved in.
>> THOMPSON: Simi says that
while the Proud Boys may have
worked hard to push into the
mainstream, many still subscribe
to extremist beliefs.
>> So, this is, you know, a
t-shirt in reference to the mass
slaughter of Jewish people
during the Holocaust, that
stands for "six million wasn't
enough."
Their view is not to deny the
Holocaust, but to say the
Holocaust didn't go far enough.
>> THOMPSON: And so, he's flying
Proud Boys' colors, and these
clearly neo-Nazi ideas here.
You know, we get fixated on all
these different groups out
there, and in, from my
perspective, I think it's more
helpful to think about this as a
broad worldview.
>> THOMPSON: The Proud Boys are
led by Enrique Tarrio, he's
this guy who is a Cuban
American, man of color.
>> Mm-hmm.
>> THOMPSON: What's going on
with that do you think?
>> If you look at, for instance,
the history of the racist
skinhead movement in the United
States, any number of different
racist skinhead crews across the
country, they wouldn't be
exclusively white necessarily.
You have, you know, the capacity
for people of-of various
different backgrounds to embrace
fascism as an ideology, as a
worldview, and, and I think
in many respects that's what
we're dealing with here is
a broad fascist movement.
(waves splashing)
>> I will fight to protect you.
I am your president of law and
order...
>> THOMPSON: In the summer of
2020, I watched as President
Trump rallied that movement, in
response to the protests after
the killing of George Floyd.
>> Our nation has been gripped
by professional anarchists,
violent mobs, arsonists,
looters, criminals, rioters,
Antifa, and others.
>> THOMPSON: The Proud Boys
heard President Trump's rhetoric
as a call to action.
They joined other right-wing
vigilantes in attacking the
protestors.
(panicked shouting)
The unrest had become a focal
point of Trump's re-election
campaign.
>> If Biden gets in, they will
have won, they will have taken
over your cities.
These are not acts of peaceful
protests, but really domestic
terror.
>> THOMPSON: One incident in
particular would be blamed on
Antifa and become a target of
the president's rage-- a
drive-by shooting in May at the
Oakland Federal building.
>> A federal officer in
California was shot and killed.
The destruction of innocent
life, and the spilling of
innocent blood is an offense to
humanity.
>> If you don't think that we
have been under attack from
domestic terrorists, let me show
you a picture of one victim.
This is Patrick Underwood.
>> THOMPSON: The shooting was
nothing like the street violence
I'd been seeing, and I started
looking into it.
I went to see Officer
Underwood's sister.
>> Literally, as I think about
him, I think about him lying on
the concrete...
shot and alone.
And the concrete is cold.
I... it's, it's, it's been
horrific for us.
And at the same time it feels
like we're constantly, you know,
reliving it over and over again.
So there's, uh, it's hard to say
that we've had closure because
we haven't.
>> THOMPSON: Mm-hmm.
>> And, uh, and actually, I
don't know if we ever will.
That's the tough part.
At first there was outrage and
anger and then I'm, and then I
went to sadness in hoping that
we were going to find the people
that murdered my brother in cold
blood.
>> THOMPSON: How did you get the
news?
>> I received a phone call at
approximately, maybe 4:00, 3:00
or 4:00 in the morning.
His fiancée Stacy said, "Angela,
Pat's been shot.
Pat's been shot."
And, um, after that, I'm not
quite sure what happened.
'Cause I don't know...
I, I can't remember if the
screaming was, was from me or if
it was from her.
And it was just a bit hazy, a
bit foggy, because you go
completely to a state of denial.
"Are you sure?
It can't be, what do you mean?"
You go through all of those
things trying to find some type
of logic in an illogical
situation.
>> THOMPSON: I see photos
from the night of the attack.
Security cameras tracked a white
van moving through the darkened
streets of Oakland.
The door slid open and a gunman
opened fire on a guard post in
front of the federal building.
But the man arrested by law
enforcement didn't end up being
Antifa.
His name was Steven Carrillo, a
32-year-old Air Force
staff sergeant.
He represented a new, more
deadly wave of far-right
violence.
>> In the surveillance footage,
what you can see is the side of
the van door just starts slowly
opening up and by the middle of
the intersection, the shots
begin to fire-- he's on the
side of the van.
>> THOMPSON: Okay.
>> Facing this way, shooting at
the guard post.
>> THOMPSON: Kathryn Hurd is
part of a team at the UC
Berkeley Investigative Reporting
Program.
We've been working with them on
this story.
Wow, still bullet holes here.
>> Yeah, so as you can see,
there's still remains on the...
>> THOMPSON: Looks like there's
three.
>> Yeah, there's actually one
right here as well, but if you
actually look on the wall back
there, there are more bullet
marks.
>> THOMPSON: What was the kind
of weapon that he was using?
What do we know about that?
>> So he was using an AR-15
rifle, it's fully automatic, uh,
and as you can see from the
bullet remains that are both on
this guard post and slightly
behind it on the wall, that
thing got off at least ten
rounds.
>> THOMPSON: And it was a ghost
gun, right?
>> It was a ghost gun, it was
unmarked, it...
>> THOMPSON: So no serial
number?
>> No serial number, which
suggests that it was privately
assembled.
>> THOMPSON: Meaning he put it
together or somebody put it
together for him?
>> Somebody put it together for
him, or from the FBI complaints,
but it sounds like is that he
was building his own weapons.
>> THOMPSON: You've got a
generic white Ford van, no
license plate, a gun that
doesn't have serial numbers on
it with a real common caliber
bullet, nine millimeter, and
basically it is a mystery at
that point with not a lot of
clues.
>> Exactly-- I mean, people
just don't have anything to go
off of, they took off into the
night down the street and no
one was able to catch them.
>> THOMPSON: The gunmen
disappeared and the trail went
cold for a week.
Then here, in the woods of
Santa Cruz county, some 80 miles
away, a worker made a
startling discovery.
>> He was setting some game
cameras up in the forest, and
came across this van.
And he looked in it, and
reported that it had some
bomb-making equipment.
There was no license plate on
the van, but, but there was a
VIN number.
And it came back to the Carrillo
residence.
>> THOMPSON: Sheriff Jim Hart
says his deputies along with
highway patrol went to
Carrillo's house, up this
winding mountain road.
>> These are very, uh, remote
isolated areas, the
topographies were very steep.
Sergeant Gutzwiller and Alex
Spencer get to the house.
When they did, they're down on
the roadway below the house,
when the shot was fired.
Carrillo was putting a lot of
rounds down stream, and he was
maybe 40 feet away, from a
position of cover.
Our people couldn't even see
where he was at.
Then Alex Spencer stood up
and spun to engage, up the
hillside, and Alex got shot.
And then, a few seconds after
that, a pipe bomb exploded near
him, and he was hit with some
shrapnel from that as well.
They then engaged him in a gun
fight.
Officer Estey was shot in the
hand.
They were able to put a round
into Carrillo's abdomen, and
then Carrillo fled down a
hillside.
I think he was intent on
shooting police that day, so I,
I think he was gonna come to the
command post.
♪
>> THOMPSON: After killing
Officer Damon Gutzwiller, police
say that Carrillo escaped in a
stolen car.
He later left it at a roadblock
and continued on foot.
>> All of a sudden I hear some
cries for help.
>> Help, help!
>> THOMPSON: Clara Ricabal
arrived on the scene by chance
and began filming with her
cellphone.
>> He had blood on his leg and
so, I mean, I knew that was the
guy that they were looking for.
>> THOMPSON: She saw a local
resident, a man she calls "the
hero" wrestle Carrillo to the
ground.
>> It's the guy!
>> How do you know?
(indistinct talking)
Pipe bomb, there's a (no audio)
gun, pistol right there, holy...
>> You want me to hold your dog?
>> No stay back, there's a gun
right there by your feet.
>> Oh!
>> THOMPSON: The hero grabbed
him, took him to the ground.
>> Mm-hmm, and the gun flew.
>> THOMPSON: The rifle flies off
at that point.
>> Uh-huh, and then he reaches
in, I think, his chest area and
he grabs a pipe bomb.
And then the hero knocks that
out like Chuck Norris...
(chuckles) and it flies and then
when he grabbed the pistol, I
believe it was in his boot, and,
then when he held it to his
head, that's when--
>> THOMPSON: So Carrillo had
the gun to the hero's head.
>> Mm-hmm.
>> THOMPSON: Wow.
>> Please, you guys!
>> Hey, we are holding him on
the ground right here.
>> There's a gun, please!
He's gonna get up, there's only
two people holding him down!
He's on the ground...
And the machine gun or the
rifle, whatever, is right over
here.
>> Two guns and a pipe bomb.
(indistinct talking)
>> Oh my God, I'm choking.
You can see the pipe bomb over
here, it had landed on a step.
And I guess the pistol was over
here.
>> THOMPSON: When it was all
over, Steven Carrillo had
allegedly killed two officers
and seriously injured
two others.
But why?
>> (on phone): The police are
the guard dogs, you know, ready
to attack whenever the owner
says "Hey, you know, sic 'em,
boy."
>> The first interview with
Steven Carrillo was 20 minutes
long, and, that second one
lasted for an hour-and-a-half.
>> THOMPSON: So you've spoken
to him for almost two hours.
>> Yeah.
>> THOMPSON: Gisela Perez de
Acha is one of our reporting
partners at UC Berkeley.
Carrillo spoke to her from jail,
where he is awaiting trial.
She is the only journalist to
have interviewed him.
>> (on phone): The police is,
it's the government's strong
arm, basically.
>> THOMPSON: Before he was
captured, Carrillo wrote
messages in his own blood,
including a single word that
would be the key to all the
chaos: boog.
>> (on phone): What the
Boogaloo is, is a revolution,
revolutionary thought...
>> THOMPSON: Carrillo told
Perez de Acha that he was part
of the militant movement called
the Boogaloo Bois.
>> (on phone): The Boogaloo
movement?
It's about people that love
freedom, liberty, and they're
unhappy with the level of
control that the government
takes over our lives.
Being free to do what you want
as long as you don't hurt anyone
else.
>> Aren't you accused of hurting
someone?
>> Oh, that's, you know, that's
what I'm accused of.
But, uh, yeah so, back to the
example... that's what I wanted
to get to, you know, the freedom
of choice, the freedom of
expression.
>> THOMPSON: Carrillo has
pleaded not guilty and he
wouldn't answer questions about
the shootings.
Did you find it hard to get him
to actually...
>> It was so hard, it was so
hard-- he would just deny and
skirt every question.
How did you come to this?
How did you... because you said
you didn't read a lot before.
>> (on phone): Basically, uh,
through... friends, friends,
you know, the Air Force.
Once I joined the Air Force,
you know, I traveled around the
world, I met people from all
over the world.
And just talking to people
changed my whole views.
>> THOMPSON: So do you think
that he's saying that he found
these radical ideas in the
military?
>> Yeah, I think, mainly from
my conversations with him, I
think he's definite--
definitely radicalized at the
Air Force.
>> (on phone): I love my
country.
There's not a day that goes by
that, you know, I don't miss
putting on the uniform, the Air
Force uniform, and going to
work and doing my part.
>> THOMPSON: Once again, just as
after Charlottesville, I was
seeing an extremist inside the
military.
And based on the Berkeley team's
reporting, Carrillo was far
from alone.
>> We matched their photo on
their Facebook with the Air
Force website.
>> THOMPSON: The team identified
at least 15 active duty airmen
openly promoting Boogaloo
content on Facebook.
Like Carrillo, eight of them
served in the Air Force
Security Branch.
>> It was kind of
substantiating this relationship
we had already been digging into
between the military and
military experience, and this
so-called Boogaloo movement.
We started to put the pieces
together and say, "Okay these
are people with legitimate
military experience who are
going out, and you know,
creating violence and noise in,
on behalf of this movement."
>> THOMPSON: So was Steven
Carrillo part of a local or
regional chapter or cell or
militia-- what was the deal?
>> Yeah, we know that he was a
part of a local militia group
called the Grizzly Scouts.
>> THOMPSON: So did Steven ever
train with these guys?
Did he meet up with them?
>> He did, they had two
meetings.
The first was on April 25.
And when you think about it,
that's only six weeks before the
alleged Oakland shooting.
>> THOMPSON: Right.
>> And the second time was in
May 9.
>> THOMPSON: So right before
the shooting.
>> Right before that, yeah.
>> THOMPSON: And what was your
sense of their ideology?
>> The movement's decentralized,
anyone can call themselves a
Boogaloo Boy, just because
there's a group of Boogaloo
Bois who say, you know, we're
colorblind, you know, look at,
you know, these people who
affiliate with our group who
are not white, doesn't mean
that there aren't white
supremacists who affiliate with
the Boogaloo movement.
They're very much so fluid
in a sense.
>> Ultimately the "Boogaloo"
means a violent insurrection.
Like ultimately, whatever the
spectrum you're in as a Boogaloo
Boy, you are wishing and
actively pushing for a violent
insurrection.
>> I think in Steven Carrillo's
case, what's really interesting
is if you saw some of the posts
he was putting on Facebook
prior to that event, he was, you
know, like, "Let's use these
protests to our advantage, let's
go out and sort of use this
moment to capitalize on it."
>> THOMPSON: The Air Force
wouldn't comment on Carrillo
or the other members of the
service we identified as
connected to the Boogaloo Bois.
♪
They said the FBI was leading
the investigation.
I kept reporting on the
movement, trying to figure out
its reach and capabilities.
♪
Outwardly, they're quirky--
Hawaiian shirts, igloo patches,
and ironic memes.
Their ideology is all over the
map: I find a Boogaloo telegram
channel filled with neo-Nazi
propaganda, and another one
filled with statements
denouncing systemic racism.
But there is one unifying idea:
the desire for a violent
insurrection.
In our reporting, we found at
least nine men linked to the
group who'd been arrested on
weapons and explosives charges.
One allegedly planned to execute
a police officer and livestream
it on Facebook.
Another one, a man named Ivan
Hunter, was charged with
shooting up a police precinct in
Minneapolis.
He pleaded not guilty, but
court records show an online
chat between Hunter and
Steven Carrillo: "Go for police
buildings," Hunter says.
Carrillo responds just hours
after the killing of
the federal officer in Oakland,
"I did better lol."
>> What's up, everyone?
This is another episode of
Flintlock Faction.
I am your host Jay Flintlock...
>> THOMPSON: This episode
uploaded four weeks before
Officer Underwood was
gunned down in Oakland,
gleefully advocates
drive by shootings.
>> ...his presence, Guerrilla
Instructor-- what's up, dude?
>> (laughs) Uh, nothing much
man, just glad to be here...
>> THOMPSON: Host Jay Flintlock,
who claims to be a current
National Guardsman, chats with
his guest, who says he's a
former soldier.
They discuss carrying out an
insurrection.
>> Lot of regular infantry guys,
cav scouts, uh, you know, MPs,
we've never done insurgency-type
things, but we need to develop
those tactics.
I think we're gonna see a lot
more sabotage and assassination.
>> This is all hypothetical.
For now.
>> Oh, purely hypothetical, in
Minecraft.
>> We-- we love cops, um, we
love them so much.
>> THOMPSON: This episode,
uploaded three weeks before
Officer Underwood was gunned
down in Oakland, gleefully
advocates drive-by shootings.
>> You know, I saw, I saw on
on your page, uh, "How to
Perform a Drive-By Shooting,"
and I was like, man that's some
real gangsta (no auido) right
there. (laughs)
>> I believe honestly that
drive bys will be our greatest
tool because its very easy to
teach, it's, hey, you know,
let's get three guys in an SUV,
roll up on this target, shoot
it up, kill two dudes and run
off.
>> Right.
>> THOMPSON: I don't know
if Steven Carrillo ever
heard Flintlock Faction.
But the similarities between the
podcast and the shootings in
Oakland are haunting.
But John Bennett-- a recently
retired agent who oversaw
the investigation--
agrees to meet with me.
He tells me he's become
increasingly concerned about the
Boogaloo Bois.
>> They were a very obscure
group, um, that all of a sudden,
you know, came on, came on the,
uh, on the radar.
You know, while I understood
skinheads and Neo-Nazis and
MS-13 and, and ISIS and all, all
the, you know, groups that are
violent around the world,
Boogaloo?
And, and, the whole, the whole
term just seemed, um, you know,
nonsensical.
So you'll see a lot of them
carry, you'll see a lot of them
in their Hawaiian shirts because
that is, you know, part of their
uniform.
But generally, there is a lot of
wannabe.
They wanna go out and they're
gonna go camping and they're
gonna do, um, you know, they're
gonna go paint balling, so they
can get their tactics down, and
it's really a bunch of kids
playing army, you know, that's
the easiest thing I can relate
it to.
>> THOMPSON: Right.
>> Except some of them have
taken it, "No kidding, we're
gonna go ahead and put live
rounds in our guns, and we're
gonna, we're gonna do something
that's, that's gonna be terrible
and impact people's lives."
They wanna be the instigators,
the, the frontline of, of the
civil war that's gonna happen
in, in this country, and they're
convinced, "We're gonna be
ready and we're gonna be the
ones that are gonna survive."
>> THOMPSON: I need to see the
movement for myself.
I go to Virginia, where a
Boogaloo cell is marching
against a local gun ordinance.
Fifty protesters show up.
They have body armor, assault
rifles and outlawed high
capacity magazines.
They carry igloo flags and wear
Hawaiian shirts and ironic
patches.
The group is led by Mike Dunn.
>> THOMPSON: So how you feeling
about today?
>> Liberty shall not be
infringed.
>> THOMPSON: Has this been a
success in your mind?
>> Liberty shall not be
infringed.
>> THOMPSON: Dunn postures like
a seasoned squad leader.
But this doesn't look like a
group that's going to lead a
violent insurrection.
I can see the threat they pose
though-- the Boogaloo Bois have
demonstrated the potential to
carry out acts of violence.
Some in law enforcement and the
intelligence community also saw
this threat over the past year.
But I've been told their
concerns were rejected by the
White House.
>> Among the counterterrorism
community, we took it very
seriously, but you really do
need that presidential level
leadership saying, "This is a
threat, we are gonna use all
of our tools to go after this
threat"-- that never happened
under Trump.
>> THOMPSON: Elizabeth Neumann
was one of the top
counterterrorism officials in
the Trump administration.
She says she tried to warn the
White House about the rising
threat of far right extremists,
but the president and his
allies claimed the real threat
was from Black Lives Matter
and Antifa.
>> Does Antifa exist?
It's not an organization, it's
a movement.
You have groups of people that
associate with them.
Do they show up at protests?
Sure. Is it a massive
conspiracy to overthrow the U.S.
government and kill a lot of
people?
No. You know, where that is?
It's on the right, it's in the
white supremacist movement.
It's in the anti-government
militia movement.
It's in the Boogaloo Boy
movement.
It's not in the anti-fascist
movement.
>> THOMPSON: Neumann says she
watched with alarm as President
Trump didn't just ignore the
threat of domestic extremism, he
incited it.
>> He attacked the governor of
Michigan, he attacked the
governor of Virginia for their
pandemic mitigation measures,
and was using rhetoric like,
"You gotta take your, your state
back, you gotta push back
against your governor."
Now, not all of them are going
to radicalize, not all of them
are going to commit an act of
violence.
But that is a huge pool of
people to be vulnerable.
Meanwhile, we have active white
supremacist organizations,
neo-Nazis, um, we have a
Boogaloo Bois movement looking
for ways to attack our country,
ways to commit acts of violence.
>> THOMPSON: Neumann resigned
in frustration from DHS in April
2020.
By October, her warnings seemed
to be coming true.
Police and federal agents
arrested 14 militia members,
charging them with plotting to
kidnap Michigan governor
Gretchen Whitmer, try her in
their own court, and potentially
execute her for treason.
>> We've had a big problem
with the young... a woman
governor from... you know who
I'm talking about, from
Michigan.
>> THOMPSON: For months Trump
had been railing against the
governor and her COVID
restrictions.
And even after the plot was
revealed, his attacks continued.
>> You got to get your governor
to open up your state, okay?
>> Lock her up!
Lock her up!
>> Lock 'em all up.
>> THOMPSON: A kidnapping plot
against a sitting governor.
It was a shocking escalation in
tactics.
Not long after the arrests, I
went to Michigan to investigate.
The FBI identified the militia
behind the plot as the Wolverine
Watchmen.
Their social media is full of
Boogaloo iconography and law
enforcement has connected them
to militia members in at least
four states.
Among the people arrested for
the kidnapping plot were Joe
Morrison and his father-in-law,
Pete Musico-- the founders of
the Wolverine Watchmen-- and
Barry Croft, who prosecutors
call "probably the most
committed violent extremist of
the entire group."
According to the FBI, the
plotters convened secret
meetings at this vacuum store in
Grand Rapids.
An FBI informant recorded the
conversations.
They met in this basement.
In one recording, a member of
the group describes a plan to
seize the governor from her
vacation home and put her on
trial.
"Snatch and grab," he tells the
informant.
"Grab the governor.
Because at that point, it's
over."
I wanted to know more about the
Wolverine Watchmen, about how
far their network went.
>> USA! USA! USA! USA!
>> THOMPSON: I hear that several
militias will be gathering at a
rally in a suburb of Grand
Rapids.
I decide to show up.
Even so soon after the arrests,
militia members seem undaunted.
They march in the streets,
openly supporting the alleged
plotters and condemning the
governor.
>> This governor tries to
control us, trampling all over
our God-given individual
liberties.
>> THOMPSON: The militia doing
security today is missing
two of its members-- the Null
brothers-- who were charged as
part of the kidnapping plot.
>> Militia members are being
arrested and stripped of the
right to be presumed innocent
until proven guilty in a court
of law.
And I can't speak for all of
them, but I know two of them,
because two of them have stood
right beside me at these very
events.
And I feel a heck of a lot safer
when they're around me.
>> Free the Nulls!
>> Yeah, free the Null brothers.
Exactly.
(applause)
>> ...still walking around.
>> Whitmer's still walking
around.
What are you talking about?
>> Lock her up!
Lock her up!
Lock her up!
Lock her up!
>> Hey, careful, you guys say
that out loud, they're going try
to arrest you for attempting to
kidnap her too.
>> Lock her up!
Lock her up!
Lock her up!
>> THOMPSON: They weren't
just angry, they considered the
governor's COVID restrictions
criminal.
And the state's Republicans were
even preparing articles of
impeachment to that effect.
>> People are getting really mad
at what she's done, they have
found out is illegal, and she
should be arrested and nothing's
being done.
>> THOMPSON: And so you think
the Wolverine Watchmen and the
other guys were planning to
arrest her?
You think that's what was going
on?
>> Yeah.
Yes.
It was going to be a citizen's
arrest.
>> THOMPSON: You think there's a
lot of people that feel that way
in Michigan?
>> Oh yeah, oh yeah.
People are upset.
They're very, very upset at
Whitmer.
Very upset.
(cars honking)
♪
>> THOMPSON: This anger at the
governor had been boiling since
the spring, when militias
rallied at the state capitol.
According to the FBI, it was
here that the kidnapping plot
first began to coalesce.
>> Let us in!
Let us in!
>> Open the door!
>> Let us in!
>> THOMPSON: Egged on by
President Trump, who had tweeted
"LIBERATE MICHIGAN," heavily
armed militia members stormed
the capitol building.
>> Tyranny!
Tyranny!
Tyranny!
>> THOMPSON: With chants of
"tyranny" and "Heil Whitmer,"
they confronted lawmakers.
>> Heil Hitler!
Heil Hitler to Whitmer!
>> Lock her up!
Lock her up!
>> THOMPSON: It seemed like a
precursor to what would happen
at the U.S. Capitol.
Armed protestors made into the
legislators' gallery and
disrupted the session.
Representative Sarah Anthony was
there that day.
>> April 30, when armed gunmen
stormed the capitol building,
is probably the most terrifying
thing that I've ever
experienced in my life.
Filled, this lobby was filled.
All around.
Up these steps.
This is where, you know, we had
hundreds of people.
>> THOMPSON: And most of them
were armed?
>> Oh, absolutely.
Absolutely armed.
When we got word that they were
coming into the building, just
sheer fear went through my body
and I can tell you that other
legislators on both sides of the
aisle were very fearful as well.
I was on the floor and I missed
three calls from my mom.
She was not sure if her daughter
was going to make it home alive.
>> THOMPSON: When we spoke, the
attack in Washington D.C.
was still months away, but
Anthony was already worried
where things might be heading
next.
>> 2020 has been building up,
it's been a slow fire.
It's like a powder keg.
I don't know when that explosion
is going to happen or what form
it's going to take.
(people shouting on video)
>> THOMPSON: In footage from
April 30, you can see six of the
alleged kidnapping plotters.
One is clearly visible with a
Boogaloo-style Hawaiian shirt
and an AR-15.
The Wolverine Watchman founder,
Pete Musico, is in the footage
too, calling the legislators
traitors.
>> Traitors!
♪
>> THOMPSON: Musico pleaded not
guilty to charges related to the
kidnapping.
I find property records in
Jackson for a parcel of land in
Musico's name.
He was being held in the Jackson
County Jail.
His home may be empty, but I
decide to take a look.
(knocks on door)
(knocks on door)
Hey, how you doing?
>> No comment.
Thank you.
>> THOMPSON: Hey, we would love
to get in touch with Pete and
Joseph.
I saw what they been saying
to...
>> That's why I can't comment,
because they put out so much
misinformation.
>> THOMPSON: That's what we want
to figure out what really
happened.
I saw what Pete was saying in
court and what his attorney said
and we would love to talk to his
attorney...
>> No, I'm dealing with it.
Tell her just settle down.
>> I'm real interested in what
really happened.
>> I'm sure a lot of people are.
>> THOMPSON: Crystal Musico is
nervous, but eager to speak
about the FBI raid and the
arrest of her husband.
>> They separated us all and
questioned us each one.
It was always about politics.
>> THOMPSON: About politics and
Boogaloo?
>> We won't have anything to do
with politics anymore.
There won't be anything.
If you want to vote, vote.
Great, vote.
I hope it does you some good
because it ain't done us nothing
but give us heartache.
>> THOMPSON: Pete was at the
rallies at the capitol, right?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> THOMPSON: Why do you think he
went out there?
>> To protest.
>> Did you go?
Did you go?
>> I did go to one.
I went to one.
>> And did Pete bring arms when
he went to the protest?
>> Yes.
>> Why'd he do that?
>> Because he has that right.
>> THOMPSON: What I see in the
law enforcement bulletins and
what I see in the court charges
are Boogaloo movement, it's
about violently overthrowing the
government, starting a civil war
and killing cops.
And to me that's fairly
shocking.
>> It is shocking.
It is shocking to hear all that,
but it's also shocking to know
that a cop is legally allowed to
stand on your neck and kill you.
It is shocking that that's
allowed and people are okay with
that because I'm not, but I
ain't doing nothing about it.
>> THOMPSON: And you think this
is in part a response to
concerns about police abuse and
about police...
>> I think it's a response to a
lot of concerns more than just
police.
>> THOMPSON: What else?
>> The way the country is going.
This is all in the Bible.
You can believe it or not, I
don't care.
Your faith is not mine to judge
and mine's not yours to judge.
>> THOMPSON: You think this...
are we at the end of days, do
you think?
>> Yeah.
I do believe so.
I think we're on the third day,
Jesus rose on the third day.
♪
>> THOMPSON: Crystal Musico's
beliefs have deep roots here in
Michigan.
Nearly 30 years ago, this was
the epicenter of the modern
militia movement.
The Michigan Militia was once
considered the nation's largest,
claiming 10,000 members.
Timothy McVeigh reportedly
attended some of its meetings
before he blew up the Oklahoma
City federal building in 1995.
(dialing out)
>> Can you hear me?
>> THOMPSON: Michigan Attorney
General Dana Nessel knows the
history well.
She says the new generation of
militias is different.
>> I think the difference is
that these folks felt supported
by those in government and
perhaps at the highest levels of
government.
You had the president of the
United States calling her out
by name, calling her a dictator,
saying that individuals should
liberate Michigan.
The president of the United
States, after these armed gunmen
had more or less taken over our
capitol building, you know, his
words were that these are very
fine people and the governor
ought to sit down and negotiate
with them.
Can you imagine?
That sounds like a hostage
crisis more than anything.
>> THOMPSON: Have you gotten
threats?
I mean, have people threatened
your life?
>> (laughs)
I'm sorry to laugh.
But it's like you should be
asking me, "How many days a week
are you not getting death
threats?"
And that's not just me, it's our
secretary of state, it's our
governor.
I think that we would be lying
if we said that we never got
worried, we never got scared for
ourselves or for our family
members.
>> THOMPSON: Though the DOJ is
handling some of the kidnapping
cases, Nessel is prosecuting
Pete Musico and seven of the
other alleged plotters.
Do you think these arrests
neutralize the threat?
>> As of today, right now, do I
think that it's still a
significant concern in Michigan?
I do.
>> THOMPSON: Nessel says the
threat from militias is real and
has been evolving for years.
A new wave of militias emerged
during the Iraq War, groups
like the Oath Keepers and the
Three Percenters.
But they've never been accused
of anything like the terror
attributed to the Boogaloo and
Wolverine Watchmen.
♪
I'm told about a location where
the Watchmen allegedly trained
and prepared for the kidnapping
operation.
The camp is deserted.
Its training course-- with spray
painted human targets-- is
littered with spent shells.
According to federal
prosecutors, the Watchmen blew
up a homemade bomb here.
Neighbors tell me they heard the
blast a half mile away.
The bomb was allegedly built by
the man prosecutors describe as
one of the plot's masterminds--
Barry Croft.
Croft is being held in a
Michigan jail.
In FBI recordings, he claimed he
had been granted permission from
God to commit murder.
I try to contact him through his
lawyer, but get nowhere.
And then, I get an email.
Croft wants to talk.
(phone ringing)
>> Good morning, sir.
How are you?
Even though my attorney told me
not to speak to you, I felt it
necessary to clear my name.
Somebody has gotta say something
contrary to what the federal
propagated mainstream media's
putting out there and that's why
I came to you.
>> THOMPSON: Is there anything
you can say about the Wolverine
Watchmen?
>> You know, I'm very unfamiliar
with their, uh, "militia."
I wasn't a member.
I was only tied in by satellite
individuals.
>> THOMPSON: Croft has pleaded
not guilty, and won't talk about
anything specifically related to
the kidnapping plot.
But he lays out arguments
against the federal government
as if he were before a court.
>> Okay.
This comes straight out of the
Black's Law Dictionary.
It's the word junta, J-U-N-T-A.
Definition number one, a
military government that has
come into power by force.
People need to realize that they
are being ruled by an
illegitimate authority that is
in effect.
>> THOMPSON: To clarify on that,
basically you feel like we're
all under military rule in this
country?
>> Yes, sir.
>> THOMPSON: In addition to his
ties to the Watchmen, the FBI
says he's a leader of the Three
Percenters, a national network
of militia groups.
>> If you look under the
militia statute, every
able-bodied American male, 17 to
45, is considered in the
unorganized militia.
The militia is absolutely
necessary to the security of a
free state.
>> THOMPSON: I saw an interview
with you, and you were wearing a
Hawaiian shirt with your tricorn
hat.
>> (laughs) Yeah.
>> THOMPSON: What do you think
of the Boogaloo movement?
>> I got a kick out of those
kids because even though, you
know, you might find some
Boogaloo Bois that are over
here, some are over there, at
least they're paying attention.
They're young, they're
motivated.
>> THOMPSON: And they're
militant.
>> Um, yeah.
They're militant.
Unfortunately, when you try
talking and talking and talking
and you don't get anywhere,
militant is the obvious, natural
progression.
That's it.
You leave them no choice.
And I-I got a kick out of those
kids.
They... you know, the one out of
Virginia, Mike Dunn.
You know, you-you look at him
and he's an inspiration.
>> THOMPSON: Did you ever meet
Mike Dunn?
Did you ever talk to him online?
>> I talked to him on the phone
once or twice before they, uh,
before they came and wrapped me
up.
>> THOMPSON: Mike Dunn.
Before his arrest, Barry Croft
had been in contact with the
Boogaloo leader I'd seen at the
rally in Richmond.
Dunn is just 20 years old.
He'd joined the Marines out of
high school but was medically
discharged with a heart
condition.
He now leads one of the most
visible Boogaloo chapters in the
country.
Dunn lives in rural Virginia.
>> We definitely are the modern
militia.
We're the ones crazy enough to
actually do something.
I think that a lot of people,
especially on the right,
Republicans, realized that it
was no longer a America of
liberty.
I think a lot of people woke up
to that in these past four
years.
>> THOMPSON: So the Trump
presidency is eroding people's
faith in the government further.
>> I wouldn't say that he's
necessarily helped erode it
further, I think he's just
helped spotlight it further.
I believe a lot of people
were already skeptical, and then
I think there are some that saw
the president of the United
States being skeptical and said,
"Maybe we should too."
>> THOMPSON: Is this a movement
that's hierarchical?
Are there commanders?
Are there leaders?
How does it work?
>> There are Boogaloo cells
within the movement.
You have a fire team, or four
people, five people, six people,
whatever.
And those teams have a leader
that they answer to generally.
As far as a leader for the
movement itself, no, there's not
a leader.
>> THOMPSON: You're sketching
out a decentralized network
where you have different nodes
on that network that may have a
leader, may have a commander and
a structure, but overall there's
no overarching general who's
calling the shots?
>> No, there's not.
>> What do you think of these
guys from Michigan who are
allegedly targeting the
governor?
>> I feel they, uh... they did
what should happen across the
United States in a lot of
places.
They were going to take a stand
against what they perceive to be
tyranny.
>> THOMPSON: Did you interact
with those guys, the Michigan
people?
>> Yeah, I'd interacted with a
couple.
>> THOMPSON: Online or in
person?
>> Online.
>> THOMPSON: What about Steve
Carrillo, the guy from
California?
>> Steve Carrillo, yeah.
>> THOMPSON: You talked to him?
>> Yeah, a lot of people in the
movement knew who Steve was.
>> THOMPSON: So you messaged
with him?
>> I'm not going to comment.
>> THOMPSON: But you saw him
online?
>> I knew who he was.
>> THOMPSON: You knew who he
was?
>> Yeah.
>> THOMPSON: What did you think
when he got arrested?
>> I'm sure he had a reason for
targeting who he targeted, and
so be it.
>> THOMPSON: I don't buy a lot
of Dunn's claims.
But listening to him is
unsettling.
It's clear that many in the
movement are connected.
And they seem to be growing more
radical with each new arrest.
There's been a bunch of
arrests...
>> Yes, there has been.
>> THOMPSON: ...in the last
month.
>> A lot.
>> THOMPSON: You worried about
those guys?
>> I think that a lot of them
will take care of themselves
while they're in, and when they
get out we'll welcome them with
open arms.
Or we have a revolution and we
free them.
When things pop off, we're going
to be liberating them first.
>> THOMPSON: Are you worried
that more people are going to
get wrapped up?
>> Yeah, more than likely.
I just hope they go out
shooting, killing the ones who
come to enforce unconstitutional
law, so be it.
We're past the point of peace.
I think about a revolution
against the government.
I do believe it's inevitable.
With tensions high Washington
D.C. boards up as if the
election were a hurricane
headed for the city.
A Trump victory could further
embolden the far right movements
that see him as a champion.
A defeat could further
radicalize them.
Throughout the year, the
President had been whipping up
fears that the election would be
stolen, and as the night wears
on with no concession speech, no
declared winner, the moment
seems full of danger.
The next morning, with the
nation on edge, I sit down with
Mary McCord, a former counter
terrorism official at the
Justice Department.
>> Obviously as of last night,
and even this morning, there's a
fair bit of uncertainty in terms
of the ballot counting.
We're in a tenuous situation
in waiting to see how the
right-wing organizations will
react.
If Biden is declared the winner,
then I certainly have some
concerns that those on the right
who think maybe this is the
result of fraud or a rigged
election, particularly if the
president is saying so, will
take more aggressive action
along the lines of what we saw
earlier this year in opposition
to, for example, governors'
stay-at-home orders.
>> THOMPSON: McCord continues
to track extremist groups and
was instrumental in suing the
militias who'd shown up in
Charlottesville.
>> Under this presidency, the
far right, unlawful militias
have felt much more license
to publicly engage.
It's given them a real
opportunity.
And they've said this from the
beginning.
I trace a lot of things to
Charlottesville's Unite the
Right rally, when the
president's talked about very
fine people on both sides, I
mean, that was immediate.
Right-wing groups, including
militia groups, just, you know,
grabbed ahold of that language
and it helps them recruit, it
helps them fundraise, it helps
them expand.
>> THOMPSON: So you come a few
years into the future, and now
we're seeing that all the time
in the present day.
>> So much more so than I had
ever seen before, I mean, you
know, if we think back, you
know, about militias, like, we
remember things like Ruby Ridge
and Waco, Texas, and even
more recently, the Bundy ranch
standoff in Bunkerville, Nevada.
Or the Malheur Wildlife Refuge
standoff.
Still, those looked very
different, right, than what
we're seeing now with, like,
going into, like, downtown
areas, you know whether it's
small towns in Idaho, Sandpoint
or Coeur d'Alene, or Port...
or big cities like Portland,
right?
They feel that they have the
president's approval and they're
using that and that's partly
why we're seeing them more and
more and more on the streets.
Not, you know, not just in one
or two areas of the country, but
across the country.
He's trying to stoke their
activity by continuing to say
that the election was stolen
and that the only reason he
didn't win is because it was
rigged.
Those are the kinds of things
that will feed in to the
narrative that these groups have
coalesced around already.
(indistinct chatter)
>> THOMPSON: On November 14, one
week after the election was
called for Joe Biden, Trump's
supporters take to the streets
in Washington.
Stirred up by the president's
refusal to concede, they demand
that the results be overturned.
>> Trump 2020!
>> THOMPSON: Hundreds of Proud
Boys gather, by far the largest
contingent I've ever seen
assembled.
(crowd singing)
Brien James is here, both as
a Proud Boy, and leading his
own group called the American
Guard.
>> ♪ Wouldn't do us any harm!
(singing indistinctly)
♪ Wouldn't do us any harm
♪ And we'll all hang on behind
>> Who's our president?
>> Trump's our president!
>> Hoo-roo!
>> Hoo-roo!
>> I refuse to apologize!
>> For creating the modern
world!
>> For creating the modern
world!
>> I am a Proud Boy!
>> I am a Proud Boy!
>> Hoo-rah!
>> THOMPSON: New Proud Boys are
initiated and they march through
the streets.
>> (chanting): USA! USA!
USA! USA!
>> THOMPSON: I see former Nazi
skinheads with the Proud Boys.
They mix with mainstream
Trump supporters.
It was the kind of crowd that
would turn out again and again
to support Trump's attempt to
overturn the election.
♪
>> (chanting): All lives matter!
All lives matter!
>> THOMPSON: As night falls,
drunken Proud Boys merge with
MAGA marchers and roam through
the city looking for fights.
Trump supporters confront
journalists...
>> Enemy of the people!
>> THOMPSON: Vandalize Black
Lives Matter signs...
(clamoring)
(crunching)
>> THOMPSON: And fight with
activists who try to stop them.
(panicked shouting)
>> Get out of here!
>> THOMPSON: A month later,
Trump supporters take to the
streets of Washington again,
and once again, the protests
turn violent.
(shouting)
And then, he calls his
supporters to the Capitol on
January 6.
>> We're going to walk down and
I'll be there with you.
We're going walk down to the
Capitol.
(cheers)
You'll never take back our
country with weakness.
You have to show strength, and
you have to be strong.
(cheers)
We have come to demand that
Congress do the right thing,
and we fight.
We fight like hell, and if you
don't fight like hell, you're
not going to have a country
anymore.
>> THOMPSON: As the clock runs
out on his presidency, he urges
them towards the Capitol
building.
The Proud Boys are here, but
they aren't wearing their
trademark yellow and black.
(indistinct shouting)
The Boogaloo Bois are here too,
also out of uniform.
They both blend into the
pro-Trump crowd.
Inside, Congress is trying to
certify the election.
Outside, the crowd is bearing
down on them.
>> Who's house?
>> Our house!
>> Who's house?
>> Our house!
>> THOMPSON: But the police on
the steps are outnumbered and
unprepared.
(people clamoring, chanting)
♪
(people shouting)
(clanging, shouting)
(siren blares, people shouting)
>> (screams)
Help!
>> THOMPSON: Around 140 police
officers are injured.
One officer, Brian Sicknick,
will later die.
(people shouting)
(banging, glass shattering)
A Proud Boy from New York state
smashes through a window.
(indistinct shouting)
The Capitol has been breached.
♪
>> You're killing me, man-- hey!
(clamoring)
>> THOMPSON: A Proud Boy broke
the window, but what about the
crowd behind him?
A mob, urged on by the
president, willing to embrace
an insurrectionary violence
that was once confined only to
the most extreme elements of
the far right.
>> It's amazing!
>> THOMPSON: Bewildered,
some wander through the halls.
Others move toward the Senate
chamber.
(people shouting, fighting)
Police struggle to hold them off
while congress members
flee through back exits.
The mob surges through the
hallways, searching for them,
coming within feet of their
targets.
>> (chanting): Break it down!
Break it down!
Break it down!
>> THOMPSON: Rioters try to
break into a hallway that
lawmakers are escaping through.
(gun shot)
(ringing)
>> Shot fired!
>> THOMPSON: A protestor is shot
and killed.
(muffled shouting)
Three other rioters die in the
mayhem.
(ringing, muffled audio)
It would be hours before the
Capitol was cleared.
(ringing fading)
The morning after the attack,
Congress's hallways are
deserted.
♪
I meet with Representative André
Carson.
>> I was alerted by a Capitol
police officer that I needed to
stay in my office.
Now as a former police officer,
my instinct is to get more
information and participate, but
these group of officers urge me
to stay in my office.
>> THOMPSON: Carson served in a
anti-terrorism unit when he was
a police officer in Indiana.
In Congress, he is a member of
the House Intelligence
Committee.
>> I can remember when I first
served on the intelligence
committee, there were leaders in
the FBI under the Obama
administration who very
arrogantly and self righteously
talked about how they were gonna
defend our country against these
terrorist attacks, so-called
Muslim attacks.
But when it comes to white
supremacists, the FBI is too
silent.
It has to change.
It has to change.
Much more work needs to be done.
♪
(phone rings)
>> THOMPSON: Hey Mike, are you
there?
>> How's it going?
Yeah, man, how are you?
>> THOMPSON: All right, man.
It's a gray day in D.C.
>> It's a gray time for our
nation as well.
>> THOMPSON: I reach Mike Dunn
later-- he hadn't been at the
Capitol, but I want to find out
what he's thinking.
So in your mind, what changed
for the Boogaloo movement on
Wednesday?
>> We realized that we're a lot
closer to a revolution.
Our recruiting and interest
went completely through the
roof as well.
They're beginning to understand
that the only answer is
revolution.
>> THOMPSON: Proud Boys didn't
wear yellow and black, the Boogs
are not wearing Hawaiian shirts.
Do you think we're in, like, a
kind of new phase in the
struggle?
>> I think that people are
learning and adapting.
I think we're definitely looking
at armed insurrection.
Many of us in this movement,
myself and a lot of other young
people like me have come to
grips with the fact that death
is a reality, it's coming.
We just want ours to count.
♪
>> THOMPSON: Washington goes on
lockdown.
The National Guard patrols
the streets.
Law enforcement agencies across
the country spring into action.
After Charlottesville, it took
months for the FBI to build a
handful of cases.
But within weeks of January 6,
there have been more than 130
arrests.
I search the list of names.
Many of the individuals charged
are affiliated with groups I've
been tracking.
But even more of them have no
apparent ties to extremist
groups at all.
What did it all mean?
>> I think January 6, I think it
really surprised everybody.
Here are groups that profess to
be, you know, law and order
in this country, and then here
are cops that are in the group
that are beating on other cops.
You know, that is unheard of.
>> THOMPSON: I asked the former
FBI agent John Bennet about what
he thought the takeaways were
from January 6.
When you were seeing the early
news reports from January 6,
did you think, "Hey, this is a
well-organized conspiracy?"
>> I-I didn't think this was
well-organized at all.
I think this was opportunistic.
They were banging on doors and
opening doors that led to
hallways and stairwells.
They had no idea what the layout
was and they were shocked that
they got in there.
You've had a pandemic, people
who have lost jobs, people
who questioned the legitimacy
of elections.
I think this was chum in the
water and blood in the water,
and it became a feeding frenzy.
>> THOMPSON: Do you feel like
now what you're seeing is
radical fringe ideologies
migrating into the mainstream
and sort of moving out of those
small fringe groups into
broader circulation?
>> The skinheads and, and, and
all of that neo-Nazi side of
things, no-- that is something
people really don't want to be
associated with, but what the
scary thing is, a lot of people
in these, these groups that
we're seeing now are your
neighbors, are your... you know,
the truck drivers and the
doctors that believe in this.
>> THOMPSON: You spent years
investigating domestic terror
cases.
When you think about the future
of political violence in this
country, are you worried about
another January 6, where it's
sort of a mass eruption, or are
you more worried about an
individual act of terrorism by
an individual or a small cell?
>> It's those individuals and
those, those people who are
plotting without a lot of
people around them that are
very challenging for, for any
law enforcement to investigate.
You know, referring back to the
January 6 events, there,
there was an individual who
placed pipe bombs who has not
been identified yet.
That's the type of person that,
you know, we're really
concerned about.
♪
>> THOMPSON: Intelligence and
law enforcement sources keep
warning me about two sides of
the extremist threat-- an
expanding pool of radicalized
individuals, and small groups of
extremists recruiting them into
violence.
♪
Looking over our footage from
the 6th with my colleague Ford
Fisher, one group keeps
appearing.
Close to the front, at the
tipping points where the day
turned-- the Proud Boys.
>> So at the, at the previous
two million MAGA marches, there
were probably about a thousand
Proud Boys.
>> THOMPSON: Yeah, there were a
lot.
>> At each of them, um...
>> THOMPSON: And they're all
wearing black and yellow.
>> Wearing pretty much
identical, black and yellow.
On January 6, it's quite
different, they had
specifically said that they
were going to come wearing all
black.
>> THOMPSON: Even without their
uniforms, I recognize Ethan
Nordean-- a Proud Boy I'd seen
in Portland years ago.
He's pleaded not guilty to
charges related to January 6.
The Proud Boy seen breaking the
window-- identified by the FBI
as Dominic Pezzola-- has also
pleaded not guilty for his role
in the attack.
I used to see Proud Boys march
with Thin Blue Line flags, but
now they're charged with
participating in a riot that had
killed a police officer.
So we go to these rallies and
the Proud Boys say, "We love the
police, we back the blue,
blue lives matter."
But that changed, that changed
on January 6 and suddenly they
are at war with the police.
>> I think sort of a transition
from supporting the government
to, uh, to believing that the
incoming government is
illegitimate.
>> (chanting): Our streets!
>> THOMPSON: The Proud Boys
appeared to be the largest
organized group at the Capitol,
but another pattern jumps out
of the footage-- men and women
in military-style combat gear.
43 of the rioters charged for
the 6th are military veterans
or current members of the
armed forces.
Extremists within the military:
it's the problem I'd long been
tracking.
The government had always
downplayed the scale of it.
>> President-elect Joe Biden
today denounced the rioters who
stormed the Capitol and blamed
President Trump for...
>> THOMPSON: The new
administration claims to be
taking the threat more
seriously.
>> Domestic violent extremism
is one of the number one
threats to this...
>> THOMPSON: With vows to make
it a top priority.
>> To study the urgent threat...
>> THOMPSON: But I've heard
language like this in the past.
>> People arrested were active
military personnel or
veterans...
>> THOMPSON: I wonder if this
time will be different.
And some of the
signs are encouraging.
>> ...a military-wide stand down
to root out extremism within
its ranks after the January 6
assault on the Capitol.
>> THOMPSON: The man heading the
DOD's effort on extremism in the
ranks agrees to talk to me.
>> We know that this is a
problem, it is absolutely a
problem, it's a disturbing
problem, and it's one that
we're going to address.
>> THOMPSON: The Pentagon had
always framed this to me as
an isolated issue.
But January 6 seems to have
changed that.
>> You're a reporter, you've
looked at the data.
We know that veterans in
America make up a small
percentage of the overall
population, definitely much less
than 10%.
But when you look at the, the
number of the those individuals
charged, we see that there was
an out-sized representation of
that veteran population in that
space.
So we need to understand what
happened, and we need to, to do
deep dives into the data to
get a greater understanding of
why this took place, why this
happened.
>> THOMPSON: In the past when I
would ask the military branches,
the Pentagon about this
question, people didn't want to
answer it honestly.
>> Well, I, I don't want to
speak to what's happened in the
past, I can just tell you that
Secretary Austin, that President
Biden, this administration is...
sees this as a top priority.
We're going to do everything we
can to address it.
>> THOMPSON: It seems like
there's a shift, a few years
ago, I was seeing guys who were
affiliated with the neo-Nazi
movements, the white supremacist
movements; more recently, what
I seem to be seeing are guys
that identify with
anti-government groups, with
militia groups.
Have you seen that shift as
well in your work?
>> Well, I'll tell you, as
society shifts, uh, and
evolves, so do... so too do
the nature of the threats.
So we are trying to get a good
handle on what we are actually
facing so we can make the right
type of recommendations and
process in order to address it.
♪
>> THOMPSON: Two weeks after
January 6, with authorities
bearing down on extremist
groups, Boogaloo Bois stage
rallies around the country.
♪
In Michigan they return to the
state capitol.
And I recognize Boogaloo Bois
who took part in the siege here
back in April.
♪
In Virginia, Mike Dunn marches
again.
>> All we do repeatedly is get
tread on!
Well, today we're not getting
tread on!
It's is not about Trump!
It's is not about MAGA!
It's not about Democrats, it's
not about Republicans.
It's about me and my boys right
here, standing together and
saying we're done, we're not
gonna comply.
The only answer to solving our
issue is armed revolt.
>> THOMPSON: But despite his
bravado, this might be the last
time he leads Boogaloo Bois in
public.
After this rally, he changes
his phone number and vanishes
from social media.
In our last conversation, he
tells me the struggle is
entering a new phase and he
needs to disappear.
Law enforcement is continuing to
make arrests.
They charge four more people in
connection to the
Boogaloo-related murder case
against Steven Carrillo.
According to the FBI, the group
had been discussing tactics for
killing police.
♪
The Proud Boys are here too.
But their numbers are small.
(indistinct chatter)
After the Capitol siege, and
the Proud Boys getting arrested
for that, for breaching the
Capitol.
>> What Proud Boys?
>> THOMPSON: There were dozens
of Proud Boys there who
were helping to orchestrate
the breach.
Do you want an insurrection to
overturn the election...
>> We want a patriotic party
that puts America first.
>> THOMPSON: You guys were never
looking for trouble in D.C., or
anywhere?
>> We don't look for no
problems at all.
>> THOMPSON: Yeah, but
everywhere I go there's fights
with the Proud Boys and other
people.
I've been in D.C. with you guys
and you were looking for fights,
you were looking...
>> No, we weren't, I've been to
every single D.C...
>> THOMPSON: You don't think
so?
>> I've been to two out of the
three, we've been there on the
ground.
>> THOMPSON: And so, the Black
Lives Matter signs that got
torn down?
>> That has nothing to do with
this.
>> THOMPSON: Except it was
Proud Boys that were part of
that group.
I had reached the end of a
trail that began in
Charlottesville, where I had
seen up close the peril posed by
a resurgent white supremacist
movement.
In the months leading up to
January 6, what I saw was
different-- armed militias
pledging to execute police and
elected officials;
ultra-nationalists brawling in
the streets with their perceived
enemies; would-be
revolutionaries in Hawaiian
shirts, and millions of people
convinced the 2020 election was
a fraud-- some of them angry
enough to attack the
United States Capitol.
After years of covering these
movements, it's clear; they've
they've been part of the
American scene for decades,
constantly evolving, and the
threat is not going away.
>> Go to pbs.org/frontline for
more reporting with our partners
including our past films
and for a timeline of
extremist events leading up to
January 6th.
"Jews will not replace us..."
Connect with FRONTLINE on
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And watch anytime of the PBS App
or pbs.org/frontline.
>> For more on this and other
Frontline programs visit our
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Frontline's American
Insurrection is available on
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